Calling all Atheists and Non-Christians

[realitybites]

I was just wondering if anyone has a difficult time relating to the lyrics of "I Have Forgiven Jesus." I love the melody, but feel like I can't empathize with the emotions described in the lyrics. As a die-hard atheist, I feel alienated from this song's message. And the Priest suit, though charming, is a symbol that I am struggling to embrace.

Is there anyone else out there feeling the same? Or am I the only one?

 

[noone]

Just replace Jesus with fate or something you do believe in. Most people know what it's like to feel trapped by your own inhibitions, no matter how you think you acquired them.

 

[Rosy Miers]

I had the same with "girlfriend in a coma".

Substituting "goldfish" for "girlfriend" worked fine for me.

I suggest you sing "Johnny" instead of Jesus, and "Geoff" for God.

You'll see what difference that makes !

> I was just wondering if anyone has a difficult time relating to the lyrics
> of "I Have Forgiven Jesus." I love the melody, but feel like I
> can't empathize with the emotions described in the lyrics. As a die-hard
> atheist, I feel alienated from this song's message. And the Priest suit,
> though charming, is a symbol that I am struggling to embrace.

> Is there anyone else out there feeling the same? Or am I the only one?

 

[Harsh Truth]

I read the lyrics as more a "when I was boy I had these unfounded ideals forced upon me, now that I'm older and wiser I've formed my own opinions and have forgiven this "jesus character" for certain ackwardnesses and insecurities that were present while growing up, which Jesus (and the whole dogma that surrounds him) played a significant part in creating and maintaining."

Maybe I'm way off base, who knows. I suppose they can mean whatever one wants them to mean. As for the priest costume, well I thinks its just that.. a costume. One he wears with tongue firmly planted in cheek.

> I was just wondering if anyone has a difficult time relating to the lyrics
> of "I Have Forgiven Jesus." I love the melody, but feel like I
> can't empathize with the emotions described in the lyrics. As a die-hard
> atheist, I feel alienated from this song's message. And the Priest suit,
> though charming, is a symbol that I am struggling to embrace.

> Is there anyone else out there feeling the same? Or am I the only one?

 

[realitybites]

> Just replace Jesus with fate or something you do believe in. Most people
> know what it's like to feel trapped by your own inhibitions, no matter how
> you think you acquired them.

Thank you. 'Trapped by your own inhibitions' is a universal message I can relate to.

 

[Republican Party Reptile]

> I was just wondering if anyone has a difficult time relating to the lyrics
> of "I Have Forgiven Jesus." I love the melody, but feel like I
> can't empathize with the emotions described in the lyrics. As a die-hard
> atheist, I feel alienated from this song's message. And the Priest suit,
> though charming, is a symbol that I am struggling to embrace.

> Is there anyone else out there feeling the same? Or am I the only one?

I'm an atheist and "I Have Forgiven Jesus" is my favorite track on "You Are The Quarry."

The priest outfit is funny, but he shouldn't wear it too many more times.

 

[realitybites]

> I had the same with "girlfriend in a coma".

> Substituting "goldfish" for "girlfriend" worked fine
> for me.

> I suggest you sing "Johnny" instead of Jesus, and
> "Geoff" for God.

> You'll see what difference that makes !

What an excellent suggestion. Thank you.

 

[realitybites]

> I read the lyrics as more a "when I was boy I had these unfounded
> ideals forced upon me, now that I'm older and wiser I've formed my own
> opinions and have forgiven this "jesus character" for certain
> ackwardnesses and insecurities that were present while growing up, which
> Jesus (and the whole dogma that surrounds him) played a significant part
> in creating and maintaining."

> Maybe I'm way off base, who knows. I suppose they can mean whatever one
> wants them to mean. As for the priest costume, well I thinks its just
> that.. a costume. One he wears with tongue firmly planted in cheek.

Thanks for the insight. It helps me to see that song from a different perspective.

 

[realitybites]

> I'm an atheist and "I Have Forgiven Jesus" is my favorite track
> on "You Are The Quarry."

> The priest outfit is funny, but he shouldn't wear it too many more times.

Is it the melody that you really like then? Were you raised atheist? Or did you renounce religion as a teen/adult? I wonder if that has any bearing on your perspective.

 

[As lapsed as you like]

He's forgiving Jesus because throughout his childhood, whenever he attended confession, he had to ask Jesus to forgive him for being a miserable, sinning little paperboy.

But hey, if you didn't have Jesus to fook you up then it could have been your father telling you nothing you ever did was good enough. Whatever you think crippled you for life have a go at forgiving it, but bear in mind that you don't have to be any more sincere in your words of forgiveness than Morrissey is.

 

[foolish_idealist]

i see it as being the force that dictates how human life should be. 'jesus' can be used as a scapegoat for fate. fate lets you down!!!!
as for the priest costume 1) i never used to think i'd be in to role-playing, but now my opinion has changed, and 2) i see it as really punk-rock, tastefully done blasphemy that you cannot quite identify as blasphemy. i see it as subtle mocking the institution and way of life it represents.

 

[betel]

> I was just wondering if anyone has a difficult time relating to the lyrics
> of "I Have Forgiven Jesus." I love the melody, but feel like I
> can't empathize with the emotions described in the lyrics. As a die-hard
> atheist, I feel alienated from this song's message. And the Priest suit,
> though charming, is a symbol that I am struggling to embrace.

> Is there anyone else out there feeling the same? Or am I the only one?

Is it such a big problem if for once in your life you can't relate to a song? Those lyrics are beautiful anyway, and I'm atheist too. It's sad you feel the need to change them just because you don't believe in god: it's not written anywhere that a fan has to be the same as his fav singer

 

[realitybites]

> He's forgiving Jesus because throughout his childhood, whenever he
> attended confession, he had to ask Jesus to forgive him for being a
> miserable, sinning little paperboy.

> But hey, if you didn't have Jesus to fook you up then it could have been
> your father telling you nothing you ever did was good enough. Whatever you
> think crippled you for life have a go at forgiving it, but bear in mind
> that you don't have to be any more sincere in your words of forgiveness
> than Morrissey is.

The quality of the responses to my question is incredible. Thank you. I guess we can all relate to being programmed to believe certain things about ourselves - good or bad. I suppose it really is just a song about forgiveness, or not forgiving, like you said.

 

[realitybites]

> Is it such a big problem if for once in your life you can't relate to a
> song? Those lyrics are beautiful anyway, and I'm atheist too. It's sad you
> feel the need to change them just because you don't believe in god: it's
> not written anywhere that a fan has to be the same as his fav singer

Well, I never proposed to change Morrissey's lyrics. I just wanted to be able to embrace the song on some level. Is it such a big problem that I can't relate to one song, you ask? No, not at all.

 

[Republican Party Reptile]

> Is it the melody that you really like then? Were you raised atheist? Or
> did you renounce religion as a teen/adult? I wonder if that has any
> bearing on your perspective.

I pretty much agree with Harsh Truth on the use of Jesus.

The song is over the top lyrically, and funny and sad at the same time. His voice sounds beautiful and it's catchy. And there's mooning going on. All the pieces of a classic Morrissey song!

I like how he describes being a well-meaning, carefree little boy who grows up to find a harsh, loveless world killing his soul and frustrating him. Where getting through the workweek almost kills him, and he wants to scream at the heavens. That kinda touches my heart. That's the experience of millions of people living in quiet desperation, so it's good someone gives voice to it in song. The stuff about having love with nowhere to turn with it is the kind of honesty that explains why Morrissey's music touches people so deeply.

My parents were never religious. Were yours? Mine are agnostics at heart, but poser-christians when asked. They never went to church except on Christmas Eve (for the music and shit), but once in awhile (like a few months at a time, here and there) they'd get it into their heads that dragging me to Sunday school was the proper thing for parents to do. Which was a joke. Midway through the services some clowns carrying big crosses and candles would lead all the kids down to the basement for classes, and I'd often duck into the men's room to hide in the stalls and listen to my Walkman instead. Because those classes were as gay as gay gets. Weirdos teach 'em!!!! And it was hard to take our church very seriously because it didn't seem like most people there were that into religion. They liked the coffee hour to network and shit. I haven't set foot in a church since 8th grade, except as a tourist in Portugal.

And I got jealous of my jewish friends when I went to their elaborate bar mitvah parties and saw all the presents they recieved! I wanted to convert!

 

[realitybites]

> I pretty much agree with Harsh Truth on the use of Jesus.

> The song is over the top lyrically, and funny and sad at the same time.
> His voice sounds beautiful and it's catchy. And there's mooning going on.
> All the pieces of a classic Morrissey song!

> I like how he describes being a well-meaning, carefree little boy who
> grows up to find a harsh, loveless world killing his soul and frustrating
> him. Where getting through the workweek almost kills him, and he wants to
> scream at the heavens. That kinda touches my heart. That's the experience
> of millions of people living in quiet desperation, so it's good someone
> gives voice to it in song. The stuff about having love with nowhere to
> turn with it is the kind of honesty that explains why Morrissey's music
> touches people so deeply.

> My parents were never religious. Were yours? Mine are agnostics at heart,
> but poser-christians when asked. They never went to church except on
> Christmas Eve (for the music and shit), but once in awhile (like a few
> months at a time, here and there) they'd get it into their heads that
> dragging me to Sunday school was the proper thing for parents to do. Which
> was a joke. Midway through the services some clowns carrying big crosses
> and candles would lead all the kids down to the basement for classes, and
> I'd often duck into the men's room to hide in the stalls and listen to my
> Walkman instead. Because those classes were as gay as gay gets. Weirdos
> teach 'em!!!! And it was hard to take our church very seriously because it
> didn't seem like most people there were that into religion. They liked the
> coffee hour to network and shit. I haven't set foot in a church since 8th
> grade, except as a tourist in Portugal.

> And I got jealous of my jewish friends when I went to their elaborate bar
> mitvah parties and saw all the presents they recieved! I wanted to
> convert!

That was a great description of what the song means to you.

I was raised by agnostics as well. But, I never went to church as a child nor was I ever baptised as a Christian. I know what you mean about the Bar Mitzvahs. They can be huge, excessive celebrations. But, I did celebrate Christmas as a child, in a very secular way. I still love that time of the year and always put up a tree and lights.

 

[Republican Party Reptile]

> That was a great description of what the song means to you.

> I was raised by agnostics as well. But, I never went to church as a child
> nor was I ever baptised as a Christian. I know what you mean about the Bar
> Mitzvahs. They can be huge, excessive celebrations. But, I did celebrate
> Christmas as a child, in a very secular way. I still love that time of the
> year and always put up a tree and lights.

Yeah, Christmas trees rule. My dog loves Christmas trees too. When I come home she gets so hyper-excited she likes to zoom thru every room like a maniac, and when the tree is up she sometimes gets so excited she yanks one of plushy type ornaments off as she dashes by, and shakes it in her mouth. I keep that type of seems-like-a-dog-toy ornament on the lower part of the tree for that reason.

I have assloads of really pretty Christmas decorations, so I do up my whole place. My fave is my Swedish straw goat that goes by the tree. (Explained here: http://hem.passagen.se/farila/julbocken.htm )

"White Christmas" is my fave Christmas song. One-time Morrissey opener Melissa Ferrick recorded a nice version of it.

 

[so many of them]

> I was just wondering if anyone has a difficult time relating to the lyrics
> of "I Have Forgiven Jesus." I love the melody, but feel like I
> can't empathize with the emotions described in the lyrics. As a die-hard
> atheist, I feel alienated from this song's message. And the Priest suit,
> though charming, is a symbol that I am struggling to embrace.

> Is there anyone else out there feeling the same? Or am I the only one?

I challenge you to ask Jesus if He is real or not.
I'm not saying to pray or do anything "religious"
Just simply ask Him the question - in your mind or audibly.
Ask Him to show you if He is real or not - and that's all.
I promise you won't be disappointed!

 

[realitybites]

> Yeah, Christmas trees rule. My dog loves Christmas trees too. When I come
> home she gets so hyper-excited she likes to zoom thru every room like a
> maniac, and when the tree is up she sometimes gets so excited she yanks
> one of plushy type ornaments off as she dashes by, and shakes it in her
> mouth. I keep that type of seems-like-a-dog-toy ornament on the lower part
> of the tree for that reason.

> I have assloads of really pretty Christmas decorations, so I do up my
> whole place. My fave is my Swedish straw goat that goes by the tree.
> (Explained here: http://hem.passagen.se/farila/julbocken.htm )

> "White Christmas" is my fave Christmas song. One-time Morrissey
> opener Melissa Ferrick recorded a nice version of it.

I usually decorate the week before Thanksgiving because I am always so excited. But, this year I am a bit slower to get out the decorations. I think it's because the weather has been so mild. You must live in the snow belt also. "White Christmas" is my favorite as well. I have never heard Melissa Ferrick's cover. I think I will try to download it today. Perhaps it will kick-start my Christmas spirit. P.S. I like the goat story. That music on the website is a riot.