'That's How People Grow Up' - Zane Lowe Premiere...

[Jamie]

Let's hope Alain brings the tunes next time b/c this and Jesse's one-note piddlings aren't working. Post YATQ, I felt like I had acclimated to expecting diminished returns and the perpetual lyrical sloth he has opted for. Sadly, I was mistaken. I find there to be a disheartening lack of effort in just about every facet of this song. Kristeen Young's ululations don't fit the song, the lead guitar line is buried, the lyrics are a juvenile first draft mess, and, as with every song Jerry Finn touches, the production has the sheen and "soul" of the inside of a crisp bag.

Perhaps I'm just getting old, but I have too many things going on in my life to just accept any old "Morrissey tune" he throws out there. I'll probably download the B-sides and let this one die on the vine. He can really do so much better. Frankly, I think he needed to lay low for another year or so and compile a definitive batch of lyrics. Whatever he has foisted on us over this past year is not up to standards. An entire album of rushed verses of this ilk is a troubling proposition.

Cheers,

Jamie

 

[Buzzetta]

I liked the studio version. I thought that it was done quite nicely.

 

[faroffplaces]

I've always found "That's How People Grow Up" to be not much more than beautifully-sung with a nice hook and an abysmal lyric, and I hate Jerry Finn to hell - so it was to my shock that I found I really loved this studio version.

Finn treats Moz' and Kristeen's voices beautifully, and I don't know if this indicates anything for the future, but somehow his trademark anal-retentiveness works for the track. He uses the stop-starty, gimmicky background sounds (yes, I really am blindsided, thanks for asking) particularly well, and I think he made a rather good artistic choice, for once in his life (B L I N D S I D E D) in removing all trace of rockabilly. It sounds regimented and Moz' voice floats above that.

I hear those who say that Kristeen's intro doesn't fit the song, and this may be true; I'm blinded, for good or for evil, by how much I like it.

 

[Roma De Moz]

Visconti's production wasn't the problem on Ringleader, at least not all the time. While there are things he could have done better (he could have given Pigsty the explosive and crashing climax it deserved, for example) it was inevitably down to the musical arrangements handed to Moz, and the lyrics put to them.

For example, I don't think the production on Vauxhall is particularly top notch. The mixing on some songs songs fails to fufill their full potential. Billy Budd sounds swamped, with the swirling synth loop buried beneath everything else, and Speedway was under-cooked in the drum department. However, the songs survive, because they were already wonderfully crafted and written.

Call me cynical, but generally I think that people want to absolve Moz of responsibility for his failed efforts by taking the easy route of blaming a change in producer, co-writer, or whatever. What if Moz had stayed with Finn and Alain for his Quarry follow up? Who would we blame than? Ultimately, if Moz had good tunes and lyrics before he entered the studio with Visconti, than the end result would have been better than what we got.

Of course, there were good tunes on Ringleader, in the musical sense: Far Off Places, Dear God, Pigsty, Work of Art...all Alain tunes, but with uneven lyrical quality from Morrissey.

 

[Jones]

I didn't have a problem with the lyrics on Ringleader. I thought they were good. I had a problem with many of the lyrics on Quarry though. There was far too much moaning about how tough it was being a popstar and how everyone was horrible to him. I was pleasantly surprised when Ringleader turned out to be full of much more universal themes.

This song seems to be going back to Quarry days though. I really don't want any more songs about how unloved and misunderstood Morrissey the popstar is.

 

[Maurice E]

Visconti's production wasn't the problem on Ringleader, at least not all the time. While there are things he could have done better (he could have given Pigsty the explosive and crashing climax it deserved, for example) it was inevitably down to the musical arrangements handed to Moz, and the lyrics put to them.

For example, I don't think the production on Vauxhall is particularly top notch. The mixing on some songs songs fails to fufill their full potential. Billy Budd sounds swamped, with the swirling synth loop buried beneath everything else, and Speedway was under-cooked in the drum department. However, the songs survive, because they were already wonderfully crafted and written.

Call me cynical, but generally I think that people want to absolve Moz of responsibility for his failed efforts by taking the easy route of blaming a change in producer, co-writer, or whatever. What if Moz had stayed with Finn and Alain for his Quarry follow up? Who would we blame than? Ultimately, if Moz had good tunes and lyrics before he entered the studio with Visconti, than the end result would have been better than what we got.

Of course, there were good tunes on Ringleader, in the musical sense: Far Off Places, Dear God, Pigsty, Work of Art...all Alain tunes, but with uneven lyrical quality from Morrissey.

I agree wholeheartedly Roma; it's a view I've expressed many times. People place way too much importance on the producer. Perhaps it is to absolve Moz of the blame for rubbish songs, or maybe it's just the musos who genuinely do feel it makes a significant difference.
But think of Vauxhall and Southpaw; considered by many (if not most) to be his best and worst albums. Both were produced by Steve Lillywhite.

If Moz comes up with some brilliant lyrics and Boz/Jesse/Alain write a cracking tune, you will get a great song, regardless of producer.
Simple as that!

 

[Well I Wonder]

It has a catchy chorus but its a tad shallow lyrically.​

 

[Piss Me Off]

Well i've only heard it a couple of times and its still in my head. Its catchy, and not in an annoying Fratellis way.

 

[Sonia]

At last I listened to the full studio version and I have to say... I know I'm in the minority here, but I really really like this song!

 

[Ben Budd]

Balls to you lot, I like it. Better than when I heard 'You Have Killed Me' for the first time.

Saying that, 'All You Need Is Me' is better.

 

[HIM]

Balls to you lot, I like it. Better than when I heard 'You Have Killed Me' for the first time.

it's shite and you know it is.

 

[Ben Budd]

it's shite and you know it is.

I disagree with what you say but I will fight to the death for your right to say it

 

[HIM]

I disagree with what you say but I will fight to the death for your right to say it

thanks, i'd appreciate that.

 

[King Leer]

Too bad you're so down on it, but at least your criticisms are articulate ().

I like the "ululations" (good word) -- they remind me of the soundtrack to Dario Argento's "Phenomena". I notice her vocals only appear at the beginning but there are no backing vocals later in the song as there were in the Letterman performance. Were they there in the tour renditions?

I do think there's a bit too much digital sludge on the track, but Moz' voice is front and center and his vocal melody is very good on this track. Obviously not his deepest lyric by a long shot, but it's probably more accessible to casual or non-fans (whether that's a good thing or not is arguable ad infinitum). I don't fiddle with equalizers, but this track benefits from a boost in treble.

Perhaps I'm just getting old, but I have too many things going on in my life to just accept any old "Morrissey tune" he throws out there.

Let me flip that around and say "Perhaps I'm just getting old, but I have too many things going on in my life AND just accept any old "Morrissey tune" he throws out there."

Having said that, I'm definitely waiting for Alain to weigh in with his contributions.

Let's hope Alain brings the tunes next time b/c this and Jesse's one-note piddlings aren't working. Post YATQ, I felt like I had acclimated to expecting diminished returns and the perpetual lyrical sloth he has opted for. Sadly, I was mistaken. I find there to be a disheartening lack of effort in just about every facet of this song. Kristeen Young's ululations don't fit the song, the lead guitar line is buried, the lyrics are a juvenile first draft mess, and, as with every song Jerry Finn touches, the production has the sheen and "soul" of the inside of a crisp bag.

Perhaps I'm just getting old, but I have too many things going on in my life to just accept any old "Morrissey tune" he throws out there. I'll probably download the B-sides and let this one die on the vine. He can really do so much better. Frankly, I think he needed to lay low for another year or so and compile a definitive batch of lyrics. Whatever he has foisted on us over this past year is not up to standards. An entire album of rushed verses of this ilk is a troubling proposition.

Cheers,

Jamie

 

[withmyheadonthebar]

I really like it, but the keyboard part is definitely nicked off something else (not "Something Else"). At first I thought it was "Richard III" by Supergrass, but now I think it's something different. And it's been doing my head in for about a month!

Anyway, yeah, I like it, myself...

 

[Maurice E]

Hmm, lots of contrasting views on this song.
It's hard to work out the consensus. My feeling is that it's 'crap lyrics, catchy choon'. What we need is a poll!

I've only heard it a few times on You Tube. My impression was that the music seemed pretty good. Better than the bulk of 'Ringleader of the Tomatoes' at least.

Will be the third Boz/Moz single (I think) after 'Ignore Me' and Satan...

 

[CrystalGeezer]

I knew there must be a cosmic reason I dislike tomatoes.